Rules Update: Master Warrior

So I guess my question is, will there be an alternative tier 3, or another way to satisfy the pre-req.

No.  All of the tier 3 skills are weapon specific.  This was done intentionally to encourage people to use the corresponding weapon styles for the trees - 2HE for power, sword and board for defense, and master florentine for finesse.  So yes, if you're dead-set on using master florentine, you can still get Slay, but you're gonna have to pick up a 2HE (or brawlers) if you want to use Devastating Strike.

Yes, you can re-spend the build you have invested in Master Warrior without re-learning everything.

Sean

So, does this mean master warrior no longer allows you to learn weapon mastery groups?

This is correct.

Where does staff fit into this pardigm?

It doesn't.  You can't use any of the tier 3 skills with a staff.

Skimmel

It appears to me that you can learn the tier 3 skills for power and protection without knowing the appropriate weapon style.  Am I correct?

It appears to me that you can learn the tier 3 skills for power and protection without knowing the appropriate weapon style.  Am I correct?

You can learn any of the t3 skills without the appropriate weapon style, you would just be unable to use them.

As a person whose backstory prevents using other weapons, I want to say this sucks.

All it does is prevent you from using 1 skill. There are way worse things that could happen. How many lore skills do you have that you have never used

As a person whose backstory prevents using other weapons, I want to say this sucks.

So you made a good Role-Playing decision.  This sucks, how?

It's far better than having a background where you don't use other weapons, and then choose to ignore that background, powergame, and open a list geared specifically for people who used said weapons in combat.

If achieving the full capacity of the Master Warrior list is THAT important to Edwin, let the role-play dictate the outcome.

You miss the point, Geoff, or at least my point.  The guy who plays Edwin actually read the corpus of the rules before playing.  Wrote the backsory after playing.  Realized MW was a list he would probably RP into (again from the PoV of Edwin) after a few years and only having a staff was no impediment to it (actually not having access to knightly weapons).

The list changed, which is not a bad thing.  That the usage requirements changed, is, in my opinion, sucky.

As to the matter of lores - Not using them cannot effect me - and I have used all but a few at one time or another.  Just as I have used all of my literacies.  It is a way to reflect what Edwin has become, as opposed to being primarily a combat character, which I have striven to avoid.

Charlie, maybe wait till you're combat ready again before getting frustrated with the new lists? By that time, some of the other higher lists might be out and you may see something else that's even better for your character. From an RP perspective, knights and other Middle Earth type warriors of the highest order never use a staff as their primary weapon.

The list changed, which is not a bad thing.  That the usage requirements changed, is, in my opinion, sucky.

Nothing has been removed, in fact its the exact opposite. You now have more options then you did before. Sure its unfortunate that you can't do x5 crits or duck behind your staff as if it was a shield, but honestly none of that makes sense. No requirements have changed, and thus you can literally get almost every skill you could before.

Woo! Being a Warrior is good now that the profs are off Master Warrior

Can you Intercede an attack that can't be Repelled just to use the Intercept portion of the skill?

I'm going to go with no.

The following is the cleaned up version of all of the text for the Master Warrior list.

Please read the list carefully. There are some subtle changes from the initial posting, in response to feedback and questions. Redundant text has been removed in favor of Traits that do the same thing.

Additionally, the following trait is added to the Rules, and to the skill Shield Bash:

Weapon (Shield): The ability must be delivered using a shield.

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Master Warrior

A character with this list may only specialize in one Path, reaching its pinnacle Tier 4 Ability. She may choose a secondary Path, from which she may purchase Tier 2 Abilities. For any remaining paths, she may only purchase Tier 1 abilities.

Path of Power

Rend Limb
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee, Superior
Tier: 1
Build: 7
Maximum: 3 Purchases
Pre-Req.: None
This attack skill injures an opponent’s limb, severing it and causing severe pain and leaving no part of the limb attached to the opponent’s body. You must strike the opponent’s limb that you wish to sever for this attack to be successful. The opponent’s limb is lopped off and she can make no attempt to use it.

Crushing Blow
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee, Targets Object, Superior
Tier: 1
Build: 6
Maximum: 2
Pre-Req.: None
This weapon attack will break the target's shield, as well as the arm wielding it. If the shield is unbreakable, the break limb effect still applies on the target's appropriate arm.

Cripple
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee, Superior
Tier: 2
Build: 8
Maximum: 2 Purchases
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 1 Power Skill
This weapon attack breaks both of the target's legs and inflicts 30 points of body damage.

Unstoppable Force
Skill (Periodic), Defense
Tier: 2
Build: 4
Maximum: 2
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 1 Power Skill
This skill removes all effects upon the character with the following conditions; Pinned, Held, and Immobilized. Any penalty for ending the condition is still applied. This skill can also be used as a defense against effects with these traits.

Devastating Strike
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee, Superior
Tier: 3
Build: 5
Maximum: 5
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 2 Power skill
This attack skill inflicts five times a character’s normal weapon body damage to an opponent. The proper way to use this ability is to call “Devastate x Body”, where x is the damage total. This skill requires the use of a Two-Handed sized weapon or larger, Claws, or Fists. This requirement can not be overridden by Master Proficiency.

Slay
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee, Superior, Piercing, Lethal
Tier: 4
Build: 10
Maximum: 3 Purchases
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 3 Power Skill
This powerful attack does a maximum of 400 points of damage. If the target enters the Critical state as a result of this attack, all effects that extend the Death Count are ignored until the target is healed from this state. This skill is hand specific.

Path of Protection

Repel
Skill (Periodic), Defense, Superior
Tier: 1
Build: 7
Maximum: 5 Purchases
Pre-Req.: None
This defense skill blocks a weapon, claw or fist attack. The opponent’s attack fails and the attack skill is considered used. You must have a weapon or shield in hand to use this skill.

Slam
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Impact, Superior
Tier: 1
Build: 3
Maximum: 5
Pre-Req.: None
This ability may be used to knock prone any person who is attempting to move past, through, over or away from the master warrior via a movement ability. The target must start within 5ft of the master warrior, or their path must cross within 5ft of the warrior during movement. This ability may only be used once per movement skill in the area.

Defensive Fighting
Skill (Continuous), Proficiency
Tier: 2
Build: 8
Maximum: N/A
Pre-Req.: Rank 1 Protection Skill
This ability conveys a +1 Soak to a character while she has weapon or shield in hand. This soak stacks with all other soaks.

Intercede
Skill (Periodic), Defense (Assist), Superior
Tier: 2
Build: 5
Maximum: 3
Pre-Req.: 1 Rank 1 Protection skill
This skill is considered a use of the skills Intercept and Repel. The effect that is being interceded must be able to be defended against by Repel - you cannot choose to Intercede an attack that will not be stopped by Intercede.

Defiant Cover
Skill (Periodic), Defense, Weapon (Shield), Superior
Tier: 3
Build: 6
Maximum: 5
Pre-Req.: 1 Rank 2 Protection skill
This skill defends against any attack that would place the Master Warrior into the Serious or Critical condition. This skill requires the use of a shield, of any size. This requirement can not be overridden by Master Proficiency.

Immaculate Defense
Skill (Periodic), Defense, Superior
Tier: 4
Build: 10
Maximum: 2
Pre-Req.: 1 Rank 3 Protection skill
A charatcer with this ability is skilled in the arts of Defense to the point that she can defend against almost any form of attack. This skill functions identically to the Valence spell Resist, as if it were a Natural ability.

Path of Finesse

Master Proficiency
Skill (Continuous), Proficiency
Tier: 1
Build: 6
Maximum: N/A
Pre-Req.: None
This skill allows the warrior use any melee periodic weapon-based skills with any melee or thrown weapon they know how to use, regardless of what hand is wielding the weapon. The ability conferred by this skill allows the use of weapons that are normally prohibited for specific lower list periodic skills (for example, a character with Master Proficiency can use the Waylay skill with a Two Handed Edged weapon, contrary to the description of the Waylay skill). This skill does not allow the warrior to use periodic skills with the melee trait with launched weapons. This ability also grants the character the Florentine and Master Florentine skills, as if she had them on her card.

Bypass Armor
Skill (Periodic), Social, Naming, Augment
Tier: 1
Build: 2
Maximum: 4 Purchases
Pre-Req.: None
By studying an opponent during battle for 20 seconds, the character learns how her opponent’s armor operates, and where the weak points are. This allows her to call Body damage against that one opponent only for the remainder of the battle. During the time she is studying her opponent, the character may do nothing but defend herself in combat.

Follow Through
Skill (Periodic), Attack, Melee
Tier: 2
Build: 4
Maximum: 4
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 1 Finesse ability
This skill represents a succession of rapid blows, demonstrating the Master Warrior's ability to push an advantage after finding an opening. After striking a target, whether the attack lands successfully or is defended against via a skill or latent defense, the Master Warrior can call ‘Follow Through’ and automatically hit the target with a subsequent attack. The Follow Through attack must be be defended against as if it was normally delivered, and a separate attack.

Perfect Balance
Skill (Periodic), Defense, Augment, Superior
Tier: 2
Build: 6
Max: 2
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 1 Finesse ability
For the duration of one battle, the Master Warrior gains Blind Fighting and is immune to the trait Knocked Prone. This ability may be used at any point during a battle including as a defense to any of the abilities it protects against.

Ambidexterity
Skill (Continuous), Proficiency
Tier: 3
Build: 7
Maximum: 4
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 2 Finesse ability and Florentine
The Master Warrior chooses a weapon and hand she has learned Weapon Proficiencies on and applies 25% of these Proficiencies to one other specific weapon and her opposite hand. Once a weapon is chosen you may not purchase this skill for another weapon, but each additional purchase stacks to a total of 100% transfer.

Perfect Strike
Skill (Periodic), Attack / Defense, Melee, Piercing
Tier: 4
Build: 5
Maximum: 3
Pre-Req.: 1 Tier 3 Finesse ability
This ability allows the Master Warrior to strike their opponent with perfect accuracy. The Master Warrior states "Perfect Strike" followed by any other skill they wish to couple with it. The target must call a defense ability, or succumb to the attack. The character must be within her weapon’s reach of the intended target to use this skill. This skill may also be combined with a Parry or Deflect - if used in this fashion, those defenses become Superior. You may not Follow Through on a Perfect Strike.

Does the immunity granted by Perfect Balance apply to Superior effects that knock you down (Slam, in particular)?

If Slam is defended against, does the movement skill continue?

Number one is a good question that I am not sure of. I'll leave that to Jon or James.

Number two, yes if it is defended against you can continue on the normal movement path.

Perfect Balance does not have the Superior trait, and is a Defense - by definition of (lack of) Superior, it won't stop a Slam from knocking you down.

Wether it was intended for Perfect Balance to be Superior or not, I'll leave to James & Jon.

Clarifications from James, which will be edited into the above post:

1) Perfect Balance should be Superior - this will be added.

2) Devastating Strike can be called as "Devastate," in the same way Critical Attack is called "Crit."

I don't remember this ever getting answered....

Are the requirements for this (and, obviously later on, other higher lists) list being changed at all?

They are being changed on a list by list basis - in this case, they have not changed. I'll update the list to reflect that, and bring up the Teach aspect (which was omitted) as well.

This has been added to the January 2012 Edition of the Rulebook. The requirements for learning Master Warrior Teach will be added once they have been finalized.

I asked this earlier in the thread and it was never addressed: Is Bypass Armor supposed to have the Social trait? If so, can defenses such as Mind Shield, Willpower, and Resist Charm defend against it?

No, and No. The victim is not chatted up or socially manipulated while their armor is being evaluated. (Unless it's a chain mail bikini.)

<<I believe the only thing that will be an exclusion to this will be abilities that pause someone's death count such as spirit stasis and the bard spell.>>

How about Physician Skills which specifically are worded to suspend the death count?

Those will also work.

so, as the master lists stand, would you be able to do a devistating strike utilizing the rank 4 master missile?

As stated in

Missile Proficiency IV

Build: 6
Maximum: 1 Purchase
Pre-Req.: Missile Proficiency III
Usage: Continuous

This allows the marksman to use any tagged skills they possess for ranged weapons with any ranged weapons they know how to use. It also allows them to use any damage only melee skills (Slay, Critical Strike, Assassinate, etc.) that they possess with any ranged weapons they know how to use.